Chinchilla Community Forums
Chinchillas => Health => Topic started by: christa on September 19, 2013, 03:12:40 PM
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Getting desperate here: My 2 year old male Chin got constipated about 10 days ago (his droppings were becoming very small, dry, and hard; he also stopped eating and drinking).
My exotic vet kept him overnight in the hospital: Did blood work, checked his teeth, administered IV fluids, gave Critical Care with a syringe, and then sent me home with Cisapride and some Milk Thistle Lactoluse , which I gave as directed. He said all checked out fine, except for a very slight elevation of liver enzymes (hence, the milk thistle).
No improvement, so 3 days later, he was kept overnight at the clinic again. Same routine, this time given some Metoclopramide along with the Cisapride. Still tiny , hard droppings, still barely eating or drinking. It is going on 10 days now.
I even added a spoonful of pure, canned pumpkin to some Critical Care and water, and fed him by syringe. Still no improvement.
Does he need to be xrayed to see if there is a furball instruction? Or checked for intestinal parasites? My vet seems clueless. :'(
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Can you tell us what his diet has been and is now?
It's interesting there is liver enzyme elevation. My first thoughts are dietary.
Have you asked about the possibility of mycotoxicosis? Check his food for any smell of mold or moisture both pellets and hay. You may just want to replace it altogether. Also please provide a background on what his typical diet is.
I recommend plain alfalfa pellets such as Oxbow which is fairly common, and timothy hay.
There is a slight chance of bowel obstruction but typically those are not caused by fur but from ingestion of threads from cloth or pieces of plastic. Has your chinchilla been chewing on a lot of plastic or cloth items lately?
An x-ray may reveal the presence of an obstruction but not always the cause of it. If there is an obstruction the meds you are using should clear it out if it is treatable. Another problem could be gas that could be causing obstruction. You might want to try a drop of simthecone with the next feeding if you notice any bloating.
Checking for parasites might be a good next step. Sometimes giardia may present like that and the feces will test positive for blood.
I'm sorry you are going through this. I hope it is treatable.
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Thank you for your response.
I did in fact change his pellets recently from Kaytee Timothy pellets to Oxbow Alfalfa-based Deluxe Chinchilla feed. I give alfalfa hay and timothy hay with herbs, as well as some fresh Meadow grass (all Oxbow). I was giving him wheat germ mixed with raw oatmeal (tiny bowl, just a pinch 3 x p week) and some papaya and pineapple (dried bits without sulfite). I will have to cut down to simply the pellets and the hay.
I just hope he can come out of his current state. I cannot keep going back and forth to the vet, and leaving him overnight, only to be told he is basically fine - but the continued noneating and tiny, hard droppings.
I intend to take him back to the vet and ask for the intestinal parasite check, and perhaps an Xray and I cannot think what else.
He has only wooden chews and a wooden hut and a lava ledge - there is no cloth and no plastic that he has access to. He also has a very large wheel to exercise on and a crock full of fresh water plus a water bottle and all is kept clean and fresh.
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At this point just feed timothy hay and the pellets you have and hold all treats. You will need to continue to feed critical care as prescribed which is usually 3-4 times a day. Typically though when there is constipation like you describe, it is because the animal has stopped eating or has cut back on food and with proper hand feeding it should subside.
The most important thing is to find the cause of the anorexia. I think an x-ray might be the best next step. Get dental x-rays and abdominal x-rays. Ask your vet about possible tooth spurs. Sometimes these are not easy to find on a physical exam.
It also sounds like his diet may have been too varied. Chinchillas do best on simple unchanging diets. I also recommend removing the crock of water and stick to the regular bottle. This minimizes the risk of contamination and your chinchilla probably will never use it. When changing a chinchilla's diet it is best practice to mix the old food with the new so there is not an abrupt change that can alter the flora and fauna inside the intestines and lead to digestive issues.
However I think what you are experiencing is caused by something more than that. If your veterinarian does not specialize in exotic animals I highly recommend finding a different vet. Most veterinarians are given inadequate training to treat chinchillas or small animals. Overall I don't see any serious problems with your chinchilla's diet and I see a number of things pointing to tooth problems.
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Thank you for all. Unfortunately, my vet group is one of the only ones around who do say they specialize in Exotics (I have used them for my Virginia Opossum and my ferrets as well) and I have had a difficult time finding anyone who will treat Chinchillas when I have had emergencies when my vet was closed.
I will relay all of this to him and see if he can find anything with the teeth.
Thank you again.
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ADDENDUM: Looking back, it does seem that I made the mistake of suddenly switching from Kaytee hi-fiber Timothy pellets, to Oxbow alfalfa-based Deluxe chinchilla feed. I was so pleased that he dove right in and ate all the new Oxbow feed, but now I see that this was the day that the constipation and lethargy began. I just wish it would work through his system with the Critical Care I am giving. I hate taking him back to stay in the clinic (not just the cost, but the stress to the poor Chin) and I hate giving Reglan (have read bad things about it for humans). :::(((
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I would discuss that detail with your veterinarian considering the correlation and expressing your concerns about the reglan. You can try probiotics such as yogurt. Try two tablespoons, one tablespoon in the morning and one night by syringe if your pet will not eat the yogurt. I know chinchilla breeders highly recommend yogurt for antibiotic induced anorexia and there may be some benefit in this case. The thing is I am no expert myself.
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I appreciate that - do you think acidophilius drops would help as well?
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I honestly don't know.
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That's fine. I am going to see the vet tomorrow; just wondering if you had any experience with this: Happily, my Chin has now begun pooping more. The only thing is, it is coming out in clusters, rather sticky. Any idea of what this might mean? I will have the vet do a fecal test tomorrow, but am wondering if you or others have ever experienced anything like this? ::shrug::
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I had a chinchilla that was anorexic due to malocclusion. That did happen on occasion where poop would occasionally come out in strands. He gradually declined to the point where I decided it was best to have him put down.
In your case this could be an improvement. Obviously the intestines are not digesting food properly but considering the meds he's on I'm not too surprised.
The critical care does have probiotics in it so I'm not sure how much help additional probiotics would be. One thing vets often prescribe is bene-bac.
Physiologically the digestive system maintains a normal balance of microbes that are required for digestion and the disruption of the intestinal flow, either too much or little, upsets it which causes irritation and sometimes anorexia. For the most part there is nothing you can do about what goes on there. The important thing is to keep the bowels flowing and hope the natural flora and fauna will come back. This is always a problem when dealing with anorexia in chinchillas.
There have been cases similar to yours that I have seen on the board over the last two years. I think two were determined to be mycotoxicosis from mold contaminated pellets. The others were caused by malocclusion. Me included. One case was caused by what I think was a bad reaction to antibiotics and that one did not make it. Unfortunately these symptoms, as serious as they are, are somewhat generic. You may need to determine where you want to draw the line. Sometimes in these cases you can keep them alive by medicating and hand feeding but it won't cure the problem.
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Thank you for this input.
I am very worried. I can get all new pellets and hay, but I wonder if I can bring about the natural balance again? I am so upset. I had 2 Chinchillas die suddenly in the past (both had been robust and healthy for months or years, and then suddenly, GI problems and all went downhill rapidly). I may try and research some natural cures such as apple cider vinegar , etc. I am very mistrustful of the side effects of all these medications the vet prescribes. I know he means well, but I don't trust it.
I have been told his teeth and bite are excellent.
If there was mold or something, it was not in the way I stored the items.
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Personally I am skeptical of herbs and other things since they also can have side effects. The difference is those side effects are not documented where the medications are and their benefits are documented.
The most successful chinchilla breeders feed only alfalfa pellets and timothy hay and the occasional raisin. When you add other things into their diet you don't know what kind of effects they will have. These animals were specifically designed to live in a very arid environment and eat dry grasses and are known to have trouble when they deviate too far from a simple diet.
I don't like giving chinchillas (or any creature) medications at all but I can understand why your vet chose the meds he did. Sometimes your only options are medicate or let the sickness take its course. When the sickness has a very low survival rate the medicine is always the best option but sometimes the medicine will kill the animal where it would not have had any hope without it. It is always a calculated risk.
The fact you have had this happen in the past is very strange. Such things usually do not happen without some discernible cause.
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The Acidophilus may help some, but won't solve the problem. It is normally found in the small intestines of small animals and supports intestinal health. It is considered "good bacteria" and is present to help the body. Acidophilus can be given as a preventative to stave away health problems, or it can be given to help boost the immune system when the pet is sick or is being given antibiotics. It may help bring back some balance to his digestive tract.
But I am not a vet, only an owner who uses every ounce of free time doing research. I am studying sciences in school currently and plan on getting a MA in animal sciences, so tend to use any free time researching. So anything I say is only a suggestion. :)
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I doubt any external thing can restore the balance of microbes in the gut. These balances are achieved by highly complex feedback mechanisms that are different in each part of the system. It is self-regulating even after abnormal events and of the science I understand if it can it will in due time. I do feel that the theory of probiotics is a little shaky for the reasons mc gave and I haven't seen any conclusive studies that demonstrate their effectiveness as a digestive aid. I do think prebiotics are beneficial. Those are included in pelleted diets and critical care.
I am always open to review scientific studies that have good controls and methods. My philosophy is if a product truly changes an organism's physiological processes it will always have unwanted side effects.
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I did some more research on this. Another thing to consider that has only been touched on in this convo is the water. I saw where you posted that his water was in a crock. I am with GrayRodent on this too, you should remove that. Those have been proven to not be good.
I found this article on the water and needs of a chinchilla. I found it an interesting read at least. Neither of us have asked, that I can tell, what kind of water is he drinking? Is it distilled, tap, or some kind of vitamin water? Here is the link to the article. It may not be the problem or an answer, but maybe will provide you with some insight to the inside process of a chinchilla. :)
http://www.smallanimalchannel.com/chinchillas/chinchilla-diet/chinchilla-water.aspx
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I use filtered tap water in an adapted soda bottle connected to an industrial style watering tube. I replace the bottle every couple of months and clean it once or twice in between. The bottle is such that I can measure the water each day with a ruler each morning so if there's a clog I'll know about it the morning after, which did happen once. The spigot can be disassembled and cleaned out.
In practice if a chinchilla goes without water for a day or two it's not usually serious. Beyond that is when you encounter dehydration and more serious digestive symptoms. Chinchillas that go to shows are known for not eating or drinking during the day or two of travel and chinchillas that are relocated to a new home sometimes won't eat or drink for about 24 hours.
Chinchillas in the wild will find dew on plants and things since they live in extreme desert climates. This water is essentially distilled so in practice I don't think is going to be that much extra benefit by giving them vitamin water. These nutrients will be included in a decent pelleted diet. I do advocate filtering water if you're going to use tap water and only if you have a decent filter. I'd recommend using RO but personally I have to settle for a simpler filter. Otherwise regular bottled water may be the best way to go.
Changing the water and cleaning the bottle and sipper tube every day certainly is ideal but I try to do mine once every couple of weeks. I have not had any problems and this is more typical of how the pros do it. Large industrial systems that use use tubing are typically not cleaned even that often and on the scale of thousands of animals. I think it can be shown that in practice it is not required but in theory it is a good thing to do.
Typically an outbreak of parasitic infections on a ranch is caused when an animal has been compromised by stress or an unrelated illness and it is passed from a symptomatic animal to others. In most cases the parasites already exist in the body in low levels and come in on the food they eat and they'll take hold under certain circumstances. Water contamination issues are somewhat rare in practice. I do, however, think having an open crock of water is not a good thing since dust and food particles can easily get in there and grow mold which can be extremely dangerous.
At least that it my understanding. And as always I am learning about these things myself. I think it's important to consider both the theory and the practice and I really enjoyed the article.
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Thank you both for all this information.
I use bottled water.
The reason I had added a crock along with the bottle, is that I had read that their water intake is better when drunk from a bowl, as opposed to using a water bottle.
With my other 2 Chinchillas, I believe I was too liberal with certain treats (back then, almonds and raisins).
I had also been told to give kale and parsley and carrots by my exotic vet (I no longer do any of this).
He seems better today, and as he was already hospitalized twice, and had blood work and dental exam, and was put on a total of 4 meds, I would like to just allow him to have hay and water, and some Critical Care, and see if he improves. I have had bad experiences with the vet prescribing all kinds of meds which kill the appetite and the animal seems to go downhill from there,
Thank you so much for all of this information, which I have taken well under advisement.