Chinchilla Community Forums
Chinchillas => Q & A => Topic started by: shadowborne on January 13, 2008, 03:15:43 PM
-
Alright, I have Silver and Amy and they have been apart for a good bit of time. Amy came back from the vet about 4 weeks ago and was checked a little under weight but that was a bit due to the food she was being given before by a person who really didn't know 100% what they were doing. She has put on weight and is just as friendly as they come, except if you make like you MIGHT pick her up then she runs and hides. We have them in the same room together right now and the cages close but not touching and currently 3 inch's apart watching to make sure they can't bite fingers off. Any suggestions where I should go from here? They accidentually met one day when my door wasn't closed all the way and all they did was sniff eachother for a while then hop away but not super fast, is that a good sign?
I am concerned because Amy, who is basically a rescue chinchilla, seems to really like any company and anyone thing to pay attention to her and Silver is kind of...well spoiled. They seem to sniff eachother and never bark, make noise, or even act aggressive towards one another. Any suggestions would be a big help and, if I am allowed to, would like to post updates on the progress and everything I do so if I might be doing something wrong someone will catch me so I can immediatly change it.
Thank you for all the help that comes along. I love this place! :)
-
If there is no signs of aggression when they sniff each other you should be fine for starters.
I say starters because things can change.
That said, let the two of them have a run togther. Making sure they have places to hide should need be, and you are on the floor to stop any attacking. Let them bath together too.Do this for a week o0r so.
Letting them get in and out of each others cage on their own helps.
If this works you might want to stop there and let them live side by side but play together.
This could be the safest option.
The problem with moving either/or into the others cage is one is already boss. They should be moved into a new nutral cage if at all possible. Or at least a completely cleaned cage & maybe change it around some.Move shelves, food dishes,houses things like that.
Maybe join the two cages together?????
It's all trial and error, and as I have said things can change at any time, between any two chins.
Just keep a closer eye in the begining. ::nod::
Good luck, I don't see a you having much problems.
Fingers Crossed ;)
-
When they move in together we plan to get a new cage that neither has been in. I was at school tonight and got home to a message, that Amy, the new chinchilla, was moving around the room sniffing calling out and we are unsure why. We assume, and you know where that can get you sometimes, she was calling for silver but not sure. So do you suggest letting them play together now or let them sit side by side for a week or so? They sniffed each other's noses and up to the top of the head with no biting, a little static charge sent them back to each of us. The first time we let them see eachother we were holding them half expecting there to be a fight and one of us being bitten. They sniffed for a few seconds and then started looking around like nothing happened. The second time we were holding they sniffed and sniffed and were checking eachother out till the static charge happened. When we put the two cages together on sunday, it's literally been only 2 days, they stuck there noses through the cages and sniffed for a good hour, hour and a half and then went about there cages like it was nothing. I have yet to hear an aggressive sound from either one and, strange enough, Amy has stopped barking peeing on my dad. He can touch her for a few seconds before she bolts off, me I put my hand in she literally hugs it, puts her head on my knuckles, and closes her eyes like she wants to go to sleep.
I am assuming this is good but I am unsure as this is the first time I have done this and my cousin, who breeds them, uses a method that i can't seem to get her to describe.
So going to break down what is going on and would like an answer about trying them out together, all 3 family members who they know would be around just incase a fight were to break out. Do I let them out together for super supervised playtime, 10 to 20 minutes? There attitudes towards eachother have yet to be negative and has been neutral, outside Amy running around the room she is in calling out for something. She did it for all 30 minutes of her out time, I was not there so can not 100% verify this. This is what i was told.
Thank you for all the help.
-
Ok, first day I let them out seems to have gone good.
They ran around looking around, sometimes touching noses but when there noses touched they jerked back and just hopped around the room. Near the end of the 20 minutes I heard one of them squeek from behind something and they both shot out, one right behind the other for a short time before they hid behind different people. Amy has some fur slip but no blood and no indication that she was bit. There was a pinky finger tip size of fur that was loose but other then that they did well. And that at the end when they were both starting to slow down and show signs they wanted to go back for rest.
Any idea's what it might have been and anything I may have done wrong?
-
Well it's natural for them to fight a little to see who's going to be boss, it doesn't sound serious but then again you didn't see what happened. Also chins like to play chase, so it could have been that. Just watch them closely, that's my advice. Keep us updated. :)
-
Ok this isn't really an update but a question that will really need to be answered at the end, just want to get everything ready. I need bedding and a good cage for both of them. I kind of like some of the larger cages, like the ones from qualitycages.com, but not sure if they are really that good. Any suggestions for cage and bedding would be appreciated. I noticed that carefresh is being pushed away by chin owners due to it causing blockages but don't know a whole lot, right now my cages have wire bottoms with a tray under the wire, using dustless scentless cat litter for the little ones. They can't get to it but I know I can't use cat litter when they are sitting right on it. Thank you for any advice given.
-
Day 2 out together.
Well we let them come out of there cages at the same time, they both jumped onto the chair to get to the floor without paying attention to eachother. They ran looking around and then it started, there was never biting but every time Silver would see Amy she would charge her and try to jump on her, amy of course seeing the chin almost double her size charging would jump and run where silver would give about a 3 foot chase before stopping and hopping around only to do it again about 3 minutes later. My only problem is Amy has had some fur slip, not alot but a little. What should I look for to see if they might be compatible in the same cage? I am unsure and think they are doing pretty well together right now, am going to let them out together every night for a little while.
Thank you.
-
Have you got a small neutral area you can let them out in together? Like a small cage or tank where they would have to interact but you can easily jump in if need be. I have been told that fur slipping is okay as long as it's not too much, it's just if they actually bite each other and draw blood.
If you have a normal sized neutral cage you can try that too and I was told that if you think they're getting along, leave them for ten minutes because they act differently around you and you leaving them might help. However I never felt comfortable enough to leave my two, I know how much damage chinnie teeth can do.
-
Sounds like they are enjoying playing together, or at least not bothered by it.
And yes one will be boss, if the other portests you may see some problems as time goes on.
All you can do is carry on and hope, thing is you just never know for sure. I have seen them turn on each other after years of sharing a cage.
-
I figured one would be boss, just worry about there interactions. There is a somewhat big room for them to play in, Silver hasn't been in it for a LONG time but unfortunatly I have a problem with neutral ground. There is the utility room and my bedroom, both of which I would definatly not suggest for either one of them. Mine is a disaster I am slowly repairing and there is alot on the floors and such that she could get into or get really hurt by. Utility room should be obvious, dryer, washing machine, furnace etc. I know scents stay around for a long time but left with little choice, read that bathrooms are a bad idea for something like that. The only 2 bathrooms I have that arn't chinchilla smelling is the upstairs one with a tub and such and the one on the second floor which is about the size of a large phone booth. They seem to run around, Silver doesn't chase Amy long but whenever she gets the drop on her she moves like she is going to bite but Amy just kind of runs away and hides for a short period before coming out and hopping around, trying to find a way over the cage thing we have covering the exit of the room. When they have interactions, meaning Amy let me pick her up and my mother has silver (Silver fights to not be picked up but once you have her she is great and refuses to let you put her up or set her down till she decides it's time) and they will sniff and touch noses but silver will put her head up to Amy's forehead and, without seeing her mouth, acts like she is trying to bite. Is that normal?
-
Alright, I wasn't home and this is there third, forth maybe night out together. My mother sat with them making sure to pet both as they came close and would let her when silver ran over, Jumped on Amy, bit down and got a large mouth full of fur. Amy did not let out any noise but jumped up to the table her cage is on, not using the chair to the table, and hid in her house. Silver was put up and turned so she couldn't see anyone or anything and we did not speak to her for over 3 hours. Was I right? Is what she did normal? It's obvious Silver is dominant and amy is not in any shape. Does this mean anything or is this normal when trying to bring 2 Chin's of the same age, a year and a half, together so they can live together?
Thank you for all the help.
-
It does sound like fairly normal behavior. Unfortunately, chins are territorial and operate in a dominance heirarchy. So fending off "strangers" and figuring who is going to be in charge are both pretty normal things for chins to do. You might try getting a smaller cage, like one for a hamster and use it as a "time-out" place during playtime. If one of them gets aggressive immediately put her in the time-out cage for a few minutes. Make sure to leave that cage in the play area so she can see that the other is still out playing. She should get the idea eventually that behaving that way is not acceptable.
Also, you need to be sure to tell the difference between normal dominance behavior and real aggression. It is normal for a little fur to fly. The dominant chin will usually climb on top of the subordinate, and may pull some fur out with a nip or two, they may chase each other a bit. True aggression usually will be indicated by any of the following: a rapid clicking of the teeth, a warning squack (it kind of sounds like a loud cough), standing up on their hind legs facing each other, urinating, and of course any drawn blood. If you see any of these it is time for the time-out cage for whichever chin started it.
I would also start bathing them in the same dust. Allow one to bathe then the other without changing the dust (unless it's been peed in). This way they will begin to smell like each other.
I hope this helps some. If not, I know of some other, more proactive measures that can be taken to try to get them to accept each other.
-
Ok right now we have seperated them noticing a major change in Silver. We would spend a good 10 to 20 minutes with Silver then turn and start scratching Amy and silver would go ballistic. She would start throwing things around her cage, start ripping up her straw mat, jumping around alot in her cage and bite us every time we try to pet her for at least 20 minutes. I assume this is jealousy and decided to check on it by moving Amy in with me. Silver has reverted back to herself within 20 minutes, my father picks her up all the time and started how he is doing amy (See family post), on a smaller degree, when she was 5 months with us. She plays tag with him, does with me also, but more so with him.
So far the two apart seem to be doing well, I will try again in 2 weeks when I know Silver is really back to normal, still bathing them in the same bath.
-
Alright after thinking I have realized, I do not have a true neutral place to let them out together in. The room Amy has been staying in was Silver's summer room, since it stays around 60 to 70 year round, and the upstairs rooms were Silver's play rooms when we first got her and didn't have the downstairs chin proofed. Any suggestions? The only place Silver hasn't been is the living room and I don't really want to try letting her out there, especially since she is able to jump OVER our 6 foot play pin fence. I really hope she doesn't teach Silver to do that......
I can get a large neutral cage for them but I don't want to get the huge cage and then find out they won't work together at all.
Again any suggestions are welcome.
Thank everyone for being patient with all the posts I have made. :::grins::
-
Not as easy as some may think getting any 2 chins together. :-\
Some are mates/friends from first meeting, some can take some coaxing, and some never will get along.
I love the "time out cage", ::clapp:: and have used it many times. Just never called it that, good one Abby
I have some small cages made with very small mesh, and have put the bullies in it while their hopeful cage mate runs around them.Works great for first meetings too as no one can get bit, but they still get a face to face meeting.
There is a more smushed method, using a carrier, box or tube just big enough for the two.They don't have room for attacks, but plenty close enough for scents.
You can add a shake of powder to the dust bath to help them both smell the same.
I don't recommend this on a regular basis, but for introductions it won't hurt. Go for the cheap corn starch based powder, some are oiled base.I just don't think they be very good on their skin, as dust bathing is needed to dry up the natural oils.
Switching them to each others cages may help.
I'm not sure I've ever seen jealousy in any of my chins, and wonder if somthing else may have peed her off.
I've seen a scattered one pout if I don't do or give them what they want. But more like if I move their cage and they don't like it they seem to stress out a bit. Or move something in the cage, but never over seeing another being better treated.
I have many that love to throw things around, and have most dishes bolted onto their cages. ::)
Your doing a great job but I'm getting the feeling this is going to be a bit of a tuffy.
Most of all you'll need patients, and time.
Remember it's quite possible these 2 will never be able to be housed together, and it will have nothing to do with what you did or didn't do.Some just don't like each other.
If there is a bully and a mellow chin, you may find it just too hard on the mellow chin and have to give up.
Watching for more hopeful signs ::nod::
-
Silver see's Amy and bolts for her, Amy see's silver and wants to just snuggle up. If silver lets Amy Amy will get close and lean against her but then silver turns, pulls out a bit of fur and Amy runs off for a bit. I have not seen any blood but Amy one day did let out a squeek and ran off, didn't see what happened but she had a little fur slip. I believe she cam around the corner, bumped into silver, and silver let her know she wasn't happy. Anyway going to put them together in the same room soon as it's starting to get warm here and they don't have a choice. Only room with direct air conditioning. Has anyone heard of the method of taking them both on a 15 to 20 minute trip in a car and then putting them in the same carrier and driving around for a bit with someone to watch them? I saw it somewhere as a method to try and help but don't know much else about it.
Thank you
-
I tried that, taking 2 too the vet in one carrier.
Well I had to stop the car and take one out they were fighting that bad. I carried one in my arms into the vet and left one in the carrier.
I 'd say your just as well off walking around the house with both in your arms.
I'm not a big fan of the smoosh method, { stuffing 2 into a small space}but did get it to work once.
The only time I have been able to force 2 chins togther is with the opposite sex.
I'd be afraid Silver is going to upset Amy, and she seems like such a mild mannored chin.
-
Alright, now that Amy is better and able to run around like she used to we decided to let them out together with a twist this time. Amy has had the dining room to herself for the past week or 2 and has been enjoying herself. We decided to introduce them in Amy's space since Amy has been non dominent (except towards us, strange) and so far it seems to be somewhat working. They arn't biting at each other though Silver tried to mount Amy (or it looked like it, she started to climb up on Amy's back and they are both female) but otherwise didn't do much to eachother. When they sat together for an extended period Amy seemed to groom Silver which we thought was good, is any of this a good sign? Is the "mounting" a bad sign that needs to be stopped?
Thank you all for your support and compassion to this annoying soul.
:-)
-
::silly:: All chinchillas are different ... each has their own special personalities. As with humans, some personalities conflict ... between two chinchillas and sometimes even between a chinchilla and a human. Have you ever liked someone, but they did not seem to like you. Or someone wanted to be friends, but you just didn't like them? This looks to be the case between your two chins.
Looks like you may have two dominate females. If you have ever heard the ole saying, "Two women can't live in the same house." This may be the case with these two particular two female chins.
The "mounting" is very often NOT a sexual thing ... it is a show of dominance ... trying to decide who will be the alpha or boss chin. If both have a strong personality, you may not be able to get them to stay together peacefully. You may have to invest in a second cage for the safety of both chins and your sanity. :::grins::
The time-out carrier is a good way to show them they must behave during playtime, but once you leave ... if they are in the same cage ... you may come back to one or two injured chins or even a dead one. I don't mean to scare you, but, I have seen it happen.
Keep us posted!
::wave:: Jo Ann
There are no dumb questions ...
Only regrets they were not ask ...
-
Hmm, both being dominant I am not sure is a case. Amy only seems to get aggressive when you try to stop her from doing something she REALLY wants to do. Silver has jumped on Amy 2 or 3 times but has never tried to bite her, has scared Amy half to death causing fur slippage but never bite. Sometimes I have seen them side by side and amy is grooming her working from the middle of the head down her side and back till silver just kind of hops off and they go there own little way for a bit before touching noses. They turned there heads once and looks like there mouth's touched or teeth or something but didn't get a good look and they kind of hopped off after. Is this a good sign? I saw somewhere where they recommend leaving them alone for a short period of time, maybe with a web cam or something to watch from another room, to see how they react? Is that recommended?
As stated they do well, Silver will sometimes seem to go after amy and amy just runs off then comes up and will nudge Silver some. Not sure if Silver likes her or not but hasn't tried to bite her or really hurt her.
Thanks for the advise! This is helpful and I hope they take up, Amy is such a good little girl and loves everyone and Silver.....well she's a spoiled little princess. My father has spoiled her rotten lol.
-
Alright, another update now that the site is back up (Anyone know what happened?).
Amy and Silver have been out together for about 2 weeks and there have been no fights. Amy loves to groom Silver, she always works on the face first, and there is no noises until Amy works on Silver's ears then silver gives her a little bark and amy stops. Silver will tilt her head and everything for amy to groom and they touch teeth several times. They ran into the same small cage, we have it with a water bottle and so they have a place to pee instead of the carpet, and silver climbed up onto amy and started to groom her head once and hasn't since. I am not sure other then dominance why she always climbs up on her but wonder when they stops, I have double and triple checked and they are female and 2 vets agree. Any suggestions for more to try to make sure they will be compatible? We left them alone for a bit with a radio set to transmit to us so we could hear anything happening to see how they would do out of sight and no sounds were heard and no blood or slipped fur when we got back.
That is all I have right now, any suggestions or comments are always appreciated and I hope everyone has a good day.